The Prototype of Protoframes: An Interview With Nick Apostolides and Ben Starr
Before we get into the thick of it, let me tell you a quick story. Back at TennoCon 2024, a day preceding the following interview, I had the wonderful experience of getting to talk to the voice cast for Warframe’s upcoming story expansion, Warframe: 1999. I got to speak to everyone prior to recording to get to know one another a bit more outside of any cameras or microphones. It was during this time I had gotten introduced to Ben Starr and Nick Apostolides thanks to Gianni Matragrano, who had a fantastic conversation with me earlier that day.
They found out that I am new to this industry and when I was talking about my inspirations for when it came to interviewing, I mentioned that I very much enjoy the open-ended nature of the questions asked on Hot Ones. The show with hot questions and even hotter wings, you know it. Of course, Ben only took the implication that I would be bringing chicken wings over to our interview the next day. I’ve gotta say he is just a fantastic actor because he genuinely looked very angry with me at the thought of not getting wings. The reason for any of this is because chicken wings are mentioned at random points in the interview, so now that you know the story you won’t be confused.
That’s enough of that. These two gentlemen need no further introduction. I very much appreciate the time they took out of their schedules for me. The only disclaimer is there is some foul language in here, and since I don’t like censorship so I’m leaving it in all of its glory just as a warning. In the following interview, I ask them to dive into their past projects as that lays the foundation for their 1999 characters, Arthur and Zeke. They provide vivid insight, and just I hope you enjoy reading the interview as much as I did creating it!
Matt: This is me, I am Matthew Reyes [originally interning] from Paste Magazine, now a freelance writer. And, I am here today with Nick Apostolides and Ben Starr who are upcoming voice actors from Warframe: 1999. They've also done some very highly reputable products as of late such as the Resident Evil 2 and 4 remakes and Final Fantasy XVI.
Nick: Correct.
Matt: All of which are absolutely fantastic. So my first question is actually gonna be for Nick about those Resident Evil remakes.
Nick: Hit me.
Matt: So the recent Resident Evil remakes are set to recapture and recreate the magic that the originals once did.
Nick: Yeah.
Matt: Like, the scene of seeing that zombie turn around for the very first time back in 1996, that’s the year right, ‘96?
Nick: Yes. Yes, sir. Back in ‘96.
Matt: Obviously, I wasn't alive for that, but I've seen it since, and I can only imagine how revolutionary that was for gaming at the time.
Nick: It was.
Matt: So when embarking on a project like Resident Evil 4 Remake, a game that holds a lot of weight and is considered legendary within the gaming sphere, what goes through your mind when it comes to honoring the legacies of games that came before it?
Nick: Well, that's exactly right. Honoring the legacy. That is at the forefront of my mind as I approach it. I wanna make sure I'm always on the same page with the creative team, with Capcom, with the community in mind, you know because they have expectations. And I know that firsthand because when I was playing all the new Resident Evil games, every time they came out, I would get excited for a year before that, and I had expectations. There's always stuff that I always wanted and needed to see for it to be a true Resident Evil game. And so then as a performer, you take on a little bit more of a responsibility to be a part of that. And so I would always tell the developers, the director, every time we did a scene, I wanted the tone to be right. Of course, I understood the character the second time around even more. But having grown up with him, I just understood him and I just wanted the tone to be right every single scene and just give it my all. I tried a lot of things and then you just put your work on the table and then you walk away and then you just put all the trust in the world in Capcom that they're gonna do the right thing and they nailed it with 2 and 4.
Matt: I absolutely agree, but now I wanna switch over to Ben real quick. So for starters, apologies about the chicken wings. But all jokes aside, I wanna tell you personally that playing Clive Rossfield is, I mean, you already know this, but that's no small feat.
Ben: Yeah.
Matt: Like, the dedication for you to take on a role of that stature is beyond impressive, and the amount of work that you've put in is staggering. But since it's a mainline Final Fantasy entry, it's a franchise that holds so much meaning in people [similar to Resident Evil].
Ben: Yeah.
Matt: That I can't help but imagine that there's this layer of pressure when it comes to taking on a project like that or something of THAT size. So how do you navigate that forest of anxiety, navigating the pressure of “How do I make sure that people aren't mad at me and people can love what I'm doing and see me as an honorable addition to this franchise that's been going on for eons now?”
Ben: Be yourself. I am a huge fan of this. You know, I've been playing this since playing Fantasia in 1999. And, yeah, it's- you described it correctly. It is almost an impossible thing to achieve. You can never achieve all of those things. You're not going to please everyone. You're not gonna do the right thing on all the occasions. All you can do is honor yourself because if you try and twist yourself up in knots, you're just gonna end up incredibly disappointed. I found myself doing my least good work when I was feeling the pressure as opposed to playing the honesty of the situation. I gotta go into work every single day and try to do my best. That's very difficult to do for 4 years because you just get tired sometimes, but you just gotta keep doing it. And then it's the after care, really. It's [when] the game comes out. It's no longer your work. It's the work of the audience and see how they respond. And so I've just really felt like I want to engage with the audience and feel like they, that I'm honoring what they want, and I'm listening to them. And I'm playing the game, really, just having fun. Like, I think a lot of the audience post Final Fantasy have enjoyed how much I've engaged with the audience and how much I played with the character of Clive as much as possible because I think they wanna keep that alive. And we're very gifted in 2024 to have that relative ease of access to the audience who really wanna kind of, like, show how much they love it, and I've tried to keep that. There's always fear of failure, and I think I still continue to feel like at some point I'm gonna let the fandom down. But I think I'm just gonna make myself proud and be honest to who I am and be the most genuine version of myself that I can be. Otherwise, you're just gonna be onto a losing battle, I think.
Matt: Yeah, because I remember when I played the demo for Final Fantasy 16, like, mind you, I wasn't really into the franchise before. But when I played the demo, something about the story got me. It was the scene with Joshua towards the latter half of the demo where, you know, what happens happens. And young Clive is screaming and it feels just so raw and passionate.
Ben: Yeah. Like I think that scene is an interesting one because it really really resonated with a lot of people.
Matt: And that's how the demo ended too.
Ben: It is. Yeah. And it and it left you on this cliffhanger. And it was a very powerful display of what the game was gonna be about. And I really like the delivery of that line because it's not a very good delivery. It's actually quite an imperfect delivery of that line. It breaks slowly. My voice cracks a lot. Like, I don't take a breath. Like, I can't even finish the end of it. And it's because the voice directors were like, just go mad. And it's almost like his entire soul is exhumed from his body, you know, because of the death of his brother. It's like everything's gone. Everything is destroyed. And so it's not the best technical read of that line. Any teacher would tell you that's actually a very bad way of saying that line, but it FELT real and raw. And I think that's what people responded to because they hadn't heard something like that before in that context and certainly not within the Final Fantasy franchise.
Matt: So I got one more question for you, then we'll switch it back to you, Nick. So please don't be too bored.
Nick: But I'm in.
Ben: He's thrilled by my answer.
Nick: I'm enthralled right now.
Matt: So on the subject of Clive, he's a character that we watch grow quite literally, and he carries so much weight, including the death of his brother.
Ben: Yep.
Matt: And understanding about other story things that I don't wanna mention here just in case.
Ben: Yep.
Matt: But seeing that we are growing with Clyde and experiencing these things with him, it allows us to sympathize with him because we're the ones controlling him. So going back to that raw power, that raw emotion. And that you said was imperfect, what do you hearken on the most to bring the most out of you?
Ben: Yeah. You just play the moment. That's what you gotta do. If you're thinking of, like, the end of the game, that's kind of not really useful. If you're thinking of, like, the overarching themes that you wanna convey. If you're trying to play something in a scene that is how you want people to feel, then you're doing the justice to the scene. You have to play the honesty of the moment. And ultimately, like in most things in life, you play what is directly in front of you, so that's the easiest way of doing that. And if directly in front of you is having to kill this monster or I have to kind of, like, prime into an Eikon or I have to do whatever, you just gotta play it out. They need to see the importance of that moment and not think about how it's gonna be received or what's gonna happen in 4 hours' time. You have to feel what is there. And I think that, in doing so, you allow for these kinds of quite surprising peaks and troughs in performance, especially when you're playing for a game that's gonna be 40 hours. Because if I'm playing the end of the game, that's not fun.
Matt: Right.
Ben: You have to play. What is your obstacle right now? How does that character think they're gonna do it? Because at that moment, that is the most important thing in their life. So you have to kinda play that, and that's why I think it works so well. You get those moments that feel incredibly important. In other words, it kinda feels like a vibe.
Matt: Thank you so much. So going in the same kind of vein with you Nick, Leon in the Resident Evil 2 remake and Resident Evil 4 remake, it’s safe to say that they're very different. Like, in Resident Evil 2, Leon is just starting off as a cop. He doesn't really see much of anything. And by the time Resident Evil 4 comes around, he's been working for the government for x amount of time. He's had a lot more experience. He's seen a lot more things. And, honestly, his voice sounded so different I didn't even know it was still you.
Nick: Well that’s a compliment, thank you.
Matt: The character obviously grows some experience, but how do you convey that with your tone of voice? What's your process for that?
Nick: I affected the voice just a little bit. In the RE 2 remake, I was really that was, like, me. Just unfiltered my voice. And, they originally wanted me to go a little bit higher. And it will sound like Mickey Mouse. Guys, it's not gonna sound good. So I was just, like, more, like, excited. And it's really just about the attitude and where it's coming from. Like, holy shit. Oh my god. What's that? Holy shit. And with 4, he was just a little slower. He was wiser to the world. And so it was just more of, his attitude changed, like, here we go again. And that just changes the way that you deliver things. Excited versus I've seen this before. Like I'm done with this shit.
Matt: Right.
Nick: You know? And I gotta save the day. But I think the most important thing that we focused on was not really fine tuning the voice. It was more the attitude in his arc. You said it right. In RE 2, he was a wide eyed boy scout rookie cop seeing everything for the first time. And in 4, he's seen it all before. And so I just wanted to pay respect to that arc and then, of course, the arc within RE 4 is a little bit different as well.
Matt: I gotta say, I really appreciated keeping some of the corny one liners from the original.
Nick: Of course. I mean, the tones, they had to keep the DNA of both games as they remade them.
Matt: For sure.
Nick: They are VERY different games. They could be different IPs, and you wouldn't even know. The only thing that is the same is the character. And, so we tried to really be careful with, like, balancing on that line of, because the first games, the originals were played by different actors, in very different directions but we had to marry this a little bit more because I was playing both.
So as long as people felt the balance but enough of a change, that's a compliment. So thank you.
Matt: Of course. And just out of curiosity, how many times have you completed the original RE 4? You get bonus points if it's on multiple systems.
Nick: Absolutely on multiple systems. Yeah. I have probably beat it realistically, maybe, like, 35 times.
Matt: 35 times?
Nick: That's an educated guess, yeah.
Matt (to Ben): Have you played through all of Resident Evil 4?
Ben: Yes.
Matt: How many times?
Ben: The original or the remake?
Matt: The original.
Ben: I've had it on PlayStation 2. I think it did about 3 times. It was the only game I'd ever done. It was the first game I ever completed multiple times.
Nick: Oh, really? I didn't know that.
Ben: Yeah. It was the first game I, like, I would usually just play games once, and that was it. And that's why I loved RE 4 so much because I just played it so many times. Like, for me, as a kid playing a game twice is actually really light. But it's a really chunky game. And then, obviously, like, I played on PS2, so I had Separate Ways-
Nick: Yeah.
Ben: -already added to it, which I loved. And most people, when they tell me you played on PlayStation 2, that's the worst way of playing it. True. But it's still one of the greatest games of all time.
Matt: In a technical sense, sure. But it's still RE4.
Ben: I've never played anything like it, and I think it cannot be understated the importance of that game.
Nick (to Ben): Are you a Mercenaries guy?
Ben: Yeah. I'm a Mercenaries guy. Like, big time. Like, I, did a lot of mercenaries on RE 4 remake, and I did a lot of mercenaries on RE Village. Fuck me. In order to get the plan on RE village, you have to pay a lot of Mercenaries.
Nick: Oh my god. That was maddening, that mode.
Ben: I completed it. So really I was like, I'm just gonna get that. I'm gonna get the platinum trophy on Resident Evil Village. So I did all the stuff on that and I got, like, maybe 30 hours of that to get that. And then it was like, oh, there's 2 trophies on Mercenaries. Those 2 trophies took ANOTHER 30 FUCKING HOURS to get.
Nick (laughing): I believe it, I believe it.
Ben: And it was like, you had to be so good at that.
Nick: You couldn't mess up. You could not mess up.
Matt: You could not drop a single combo.
Ben: Yeah. It was like you had to keep this combo going, and it was absolutely incredible and infuriating at the same time. And I think when I did it, I was like, my heart was just in that.
Nick: Sometimes they got stuck in the walls and you couldn't shoot them.
Ben: They were a lot more forgiving in the RE4 remake.
Matt: Just one last thing about Mercenaries before I go back is the thing that always got me was enemies that were sniping from top, from always up top, those with arrows, because they're so hard to see because they blend in so well. So that just didn't make it, any better. But, going back to you, Ben-
Ben: Mhmm.
Matt: To talk about Warframe now. Arthur is, well, he's not as angry as Clive is, at least not to the same extent. He doesn't have a living being inside of him the way Clive does. And Warframe also doesn't have the same almost claustrophobic tone that Final Fantasy does. Like, when things are really tense in a cutscene, you feel the tension, like, almost to the point where you feel like if you breathe, someone's gonna get mad at you for making noise.
Ben: Yeah.
Matt: So since Warframe doesn't hold the same tone that Final Fantasy does in the sense that it's not as foreboding, did you find yourself having a bit more fun with Arthur since you were a bit looser as you didn't have to hold onto so much emotional trauma the same way Clive did?
Ben: I think, yeah. It's like I said, it's all about playing what's directly in front of you. And the first thing that we're introduced to with Warframe: 1999 is the team. You know, it's nice. He's not a one man army. He's very much part of a much wider group, and that's the joy of what Warframe is. So I think the most fun people are gonna have and how they're gonna enjoy Arthur is not by himself, it's gonna be in relation to all the other characters. So that's why we get all of them on display at the beginning, and how much they work as a team. It was a real joy. And I think Clive thrives best when he's reacting off other people, when he's reacting off Jill and Joshua. I think, actually, Arthur does a really, really similar thing when he's, you know, combinations with, you know, Aoi or Amir or Quincy. You know, it's very cool to see as you play more of the game, you can see how that kind of affects it as well.
Matt: Absolutely. So now I got 2 more questions, but these are for both of you. I want answers from the both of you. So did nostalgia play a big role in how you conveyed your characters in Warframe: 1999? And if so, what makes the year slash time period so special to you?
Nick: Yeah. It was a very unique time in my life. I was in my mid teens during this time. ‘99. I was about 15 in ‘99. And, I was just, I've never- I'm not the boy band type of guy, but I have a lot of, like, similar energy. And so I would see, like, Backstreet Boys, NSYNC. They were all becoming very popular at that time. And I was very aware of that and, like, how they affected people. All the fans, my friends LOVED them. And so I was just kinda like putting myself in that place and I formed a lot of my musical tastes during that time as well. And so I just kinda kinda transported myself back. It's not that hard because it was a fun time in my life, and I really, I developed slowly into the adult I am now at that time. So it's actually a really cool thing to have a game go back in time.
Matt: Oh yeah, for sure. What about you, Ben?
Ben: I think you can't, you said it yourself, you can't really underestimate the power of nostalgia. It's an incredible drug, and I remember exactly where I was in 1999. I was, I think, 11. And it was huge. I was actually doing my first ever acting job in 1999.
Matt: Really? What was it?
Ben: I was playing Gavroche in the national touring company of Les Miserables, The Little Urchin Boy. And I have this poster that says 1999 to 2000. There was a genuine fear that we wouldn't get to 2000 because of the Y2K mug. It was this kind of silly joke that we had in the cast. And so, yeah, it was kind of my professional debut as an actor at that point, but also just the excitement of what was to come, you know, the ending. There's so much literature around 1999 and what that meant. Was it the end of the world? Was it the beginning of something new?
And I love the way looking back on it now is kind of, like, how crazy that hysteria was. But what we've done in 1999 is looking back and going, what if that hysteria was real? And I knew someone who took all their money out of the bank and put it in gold bars and buried it at the end of their garden because they thought the financial system was gonna crash. Wow. Like, that was, like, one of our kind of, like, crazy friends. My mom's friend took all the money out of her bank because she thought the world was gonna end.
Nick: That's what a lot of people did, yeah.
Ben: Because the banking system was gonna fail. They thought their entire life savings were gonna disappear. And it really can't be underestimated, though, like how actually terrifying that was to some people. Obviously, it was a whimper, but it was a real potential threat to something. And actually, how much we relied on computers. And I think a lot of that's what this is, you know. It's the fear of the fear of, like, relying too much on technology and as a concept and how, you know, the what the Proto-Warframes kind of- Protoframes, sorry, the Protoframes represent is that kind of, like, weird crossing between humanity and, you know, represent is that kind of, like, weird crossing between humanity and essentially, you know, technology. So it's a pretty cool thing to do. But 1999 for me was pop music, a bit of grunge, and the Millennium Dome. In the UK, the Millennium Dome was a huge thing.
Nick: What's that?
Ben: The Millennium Dome is now called the O2 Arena, but it was this, almost monument to the past and, like, and the government spent millions of pounds on this high, huge dome near Canary Wharf. It's still there. It's now called the O2 Arena where most people can kinda do performances, but, like, so much money was plowed into this thing. It's become this iconic landmark in London now. But it was just like it was, it was a bit like a time capsule. It was so crazy. It was like this is history. It's just like if aliens landed and when the world ended, it was almost like come and have a look at this thing.
Nick: How have I never heard of this?
Ben: Because it's now because it doesn't exist anymore. The building exists, but it was iconic and it became part of the, you know, when you think about, like, what London is and you pan over in those movies, it'll always show you the Millennium Dome, what is now the O2 arena. That's wild. Yeah. And the London Eye was there as well. Like, the government spent so much money. There's also this thing, (Ben looks directly at me) sorry to kind of get onto it-
Matt (laughing): It’s fine.
Ben: -in London. Right. There is this Millennium architecture, and there's this very specific type of architecture that exists in London that was specifically designed for the new year. And it's this kind of- and it hasn't aged very well- but it's this kind of chrome metal that looks kind of disgusting, and it's got kind of these unnecessarily smooth edges. And it's all now 25 years old and it looks so ugly. It looks really, really bad.
Nick: Can you take me there next time?
Ben: Yeah I'll take you around and be like here it is you like this ugly bridge? Guess what? Millennium. You like this ugly thing? Millennium.
Matt: So I have one last question for you guys before we could wrap this up. What is the impact you hope to leave with fans that play through Warframe 1999? What is something you want them to remember from this experience, whether that's with your character, throughout just the entirety of the experience, whatever it may be?
Nick: I want them to know that they are cared about. I want them to know that their opinions matter in this world within Warframe and with Digital Extremes, that they're listened to. I think that's the biggest thing.
Matt: Yeah, of course.
Ben: I want them to feel like a badass. I just want them to feel like a badass. I just want them to feel cool that you said, like, it's not for us. It's for the fans to take on now. And if, you know, whatever, if playing through this expansion, if being able to play as these, you know, the skins and the Protoframes, if that makes them feel like cool brained. Like, be cool, however you wanna be cool, whatever makes you feel cool. Like, whatever makes you feel powerful and empowered and seen, I think that's what this game is about, if you don't wanna pick Arthur, you can pick whatever you want because here are all the different paintbrushes to enjoy this video game. So I hope they feel like they have more paints at their disposal to express themselves.
Matt: And there's nothing better than player expression. Thank you guys so very much for doing this and for your time. Again, I'm sorry about the wings, but it was an absolute pleasure to talk to you guys. I love the insight. Thank you so very much for the time.
Ben: We’re just messing with you, bud. We don't need the wings.
They found out that I am new to this industry and when I was talking about my inspirations for when it came to interviewing, I mentioned that I very much enjoy the open-ended nature of the questions asked on Hot Ones. The show with hot questions and even hotter wings, you know it. Of course, Ben only took the implication that I would be bringing chicken wings over to our interview the next day. I’ve gotta say he is just a fantastic actor because he genuinely looked very angry with me at the thought of not getting wings. The reason for any of this is because chicken wings are mentioned at random points in the interview, so now that you know the story you won’t be confused.
That’s enough of that. These two gentlemen need no further introduction. I very much appreciate the time they took out of their schedules for me. The only disclaimer is there is some foul language in here, and since I don’t like censorship so I’m leaving it in all of its glory just as a warning. In the following interview, I ask them to dive into their past projects as that lays the foundation for their 1999 characters, Arthur and Zeke. They provide vivid insight, and just I hope you enjoy reading the interview as much as I did creating it!
Matt: This is me, I am Matthew Reyes [originally interning] from Paste Magazine, now a freelance writer. And, I am here today with Nick Apostolides and Ben Starr who are upcoming voice actors from Warframe: 1999. They've also done some very highly reputable products as of late such as the Resident Evil 2 and 4 remakes and Final Fantasy XVI.
Nick: Correct.
Matt: All of which are absolutely fantastic. So my first question is actually gonna be for Nick about those Resident Evil remakes.
Nick: Hit me.
Matt: So the recent Resident Evil remakes are set to recapture and recreate the magic that the originals once did.
Nick: Yeah.
Matt: Like, the scene of seeing that zombie turn around for the very first time back in 1996, that’s the year right, ‘96?
Nick: Yes. Yes, sir. Back in ‘96.
Matt: Obviously, I wasn't alive for that, but I've seen it since, and I can only imagine how revolutionary that was for gaming at the time.
Nick: It was.
Matt: So when embarking on a project like Resident Evil 4 Remake, a game that holds a lot of weight and is considered legendary within the gaming sphere, what goes through your mind when it comes to honoring the legacies of games that came before it?
Nick: Well, that's exactly right. Honoring the legacy. That is at the forefront of my mind as I approach it. I wanna make sure I'm always on the same page with the creative team, with Capcom, with the community in mind, you know because they have expectations. And I know that firsthand because when I was playing all the new Resident Evil games, every time they came out, I would get excited for a year before that, and I had expectations. There's always stuff that I always wanted and needed to see for it to be a true Resident Evil game. And so then as a performer, you take on a little bit more of a responsibility to be a part of that. And so I would always tell the developers, the director, every time we did a scene, I wanted the tone to be right. Of course, I understood the character the second time around even more. But having grown up with him, I just understood him and I just wanted the tone to be right every single scene and just give it my all. I tried a lot of things and then you just put your work on the table and then you walk away and then you just put all the trust in the world in Capcom that they're gonna do the right thing and they nailed it with 2 and 4.
Matt: I absolutely agree, but now I wanna switch over to Ben real quick. So for starters, apologies about the chicken wings. But all jokes aside, I wanna tell you personally that playing Clive Rossfield is, I mean, you already know this, but that's no small feat.
Ben: Yeah.
Matt: Like, the dedication for you to take on a role of that stature is beyond impressive, and the amount of work that you've put in is staggering. But since it's a mainline Final Fantasy entry, it's a franchise that holds so much meaning in people [similar to Resident Evil].
Ben: Yeah.
Matt: That I can't help but imagine that there's this layer of pressure when it comes to taking on a project like that or something of THAT size. So how do you navigate that forest of anxiety, navigating the pressure of “How do I make sure that people aren't mad at me and people can love what I'm doing and see me as an honorable addition to this franchise that's been going on for eons now?”
Ben: Be yourself. I am a huge fan of this. You know, I've been playing this since playing Fantasia in 1999. And, yeah, it's- you described it correctly. It is almost an impossible thing to achieve. You can never achieve all of those things. You're not going to please everyone. You're not gonna do the right thing on all the occasions. All you can do is honor yourself because if you try and twist yourself up in knots, you're just gonna end up incredibly disappointed. I found myself doing my least good work when I was feeling the pressure as opposed to playing the honesty of the situation. I gotta go into work every single day and try to do my best. That's very difficult to do for 4 years because you just get tired sometimes, but you just gotta keep doing it. And then it's the after care, really. It's [when] the game comes out. It's no longer your work. It's the work of the audience and see how they respond. And so I've just really felt like I want to engage with the audience and feel like they, that I'm honoring what they want, and I'm listening to them. And I'm playing the game, really, just having fun. Like, I think a lot of the audience post Final Fantasy have enjoyed how much I've engaged with the audience and how much I played with the character of Clive as much as possible because I think they wanna keep that alive. And we're very gifted in 2024 to have that relative ease of access to the audience who really wanna kind of, like, show how much they love it, and I've tried to keep that. There's always fear of failure, and I think I still continue to feel like at some point I'm gonna let the fandom down. But I think I'm just gonna make myself proud and be honest to who I am and be the most genuine version of myself that I can be. Otherwise, you're just gonna be onto a losing battle, I think.
Matt: Yeah, because I remember when I played the demo for Final Fantasy 16, like, mind you, I wasn't really into the franchise before. But when I played the demo, something about the story got me. It was the scene with Joshua towards the latter half of the demo where, you know, what happens happens. And young Clive is screaming and it feels just so raw and passionate.
Ben: Yeah. Like I think that scene is an interesting one because it really really resonated with a lot of people.
Matt: And that's how the demo ended too.
Ben: It is. Yeah. And it and it left you on this cliffhanger. And it was a very powerful display of what the game was gonna be about. And I really like the delivery of that line because it's not a very good delivery. It's actually quite an imperfect delivery of that line. It breaks slowly. My voice cracks a lot. Like, I don't take a breath. Like, I can't even finish the end of it. And it's because the voice directors were like, just go mad. And it's almost like his entire soul is exhumed from his body, you know, because of the death of his brother. It's like everything's gone. Everything is destroyed. And so it's not the best technical read of that line. Any teacher would tell you that's actually a very bad way of saying that line, but it FELT real and raw. And I think that's what people responded to because they hadn't heard something like that before in that context and certainly not within the Final Fantasy franchise.
Matt: So I got one more question for you, then we'll switch it back to you, Nick. So please don't be too bored.
Nick: But I'm in.
Ben: He's thrilled by my answer.
Nick: I'm enthralled right now.
Matt: So on the subject of Clive, he's a character that we watch grow quite literally, and he carries so much weight, including the death of his brother.
Ben: Yep.
Matt: And understanding about other story things that I don't wanna mention here just in case.
Ben: Yep.
Matt: But seeing that we are growing with Clyde and experiencing these things with him, it allows us to sympathize with him because we're the ones controlling him. So going back to that raw power, that raw emotion. And that you said was imperfect, what do you hearken on the most to bring the most out of you?
Ben: Yeah. You just play the moment. That's what you gotta do. If you're thinking of, like, the end of the game, that's kind of not really useful. If you're thinking of, like, the overarching themes that you wanna convey. If you're trying to play something in a scene that is how you want people to feel, then you're doing the justice to the scene. You have to play the honesty of the moment. And ultimately, like in most things in life, you play what is directly in front of you, so that's the easiest way of doing that. And if directly in front of you is having to kill this monster or I have to kind of, like, prime into an Eikon or I have to do whatever, you just gotta play it out. They need to see the importance of that moment and not think about how it's gonna be received or what's gonna happen in 4 hours' time. You have to feel what is there. And I think that, in doing so, you allow for these kinds of quite surprising peaks and troughs in performance, especially when you're playing for a game that's gonna be 40 hours. Because if I'm playing the end of the game, that's not fun.
Matt: Right.
Ben: You have to play. What is your obstacle right now? How does that character think they're gonna do it? Because at that moment, that is the most important thing in their life. So you have to kinda play that, and that's why I think it works so well. You get those moments that feel incredibly important. In other words, it kinda feels like a vibe.
Matt: Thank you so much. So going in the same kind of vein with you Nick, Leon in the Resident Evil 2 remake and Resident Evil 4 remake, it’s safe to say that they're very different. Like, in Resident Evil 2, Leon is just starting off as a cop. He doesn't really see much of anything. And by the time Resident Evil 4 comes around, he's been working for the government for x amount of time. He's had a lot more experience. He's seen a lot more things. And, honestly, his voice sounded so different I didn't even know it was still you.
Nick: Well that’s a compliment, thank you.
Matt: The character obviously grows some experience, but how do you convey that with your tone of voice? What's your process for that?
Nick: I affected the voice just a little bit. In the RE 2 remake, I was really that was, like, me. Just unfiltered my voice. And, they originally wanted me to go a little bit higher. And it will sound like Mickey Mouse. Guys, it's not gonna sound good. So I was just, like, more, like, excited. And it's really just about the attitude and where it's coming from. Like, holy shit. Oh my god. What's that? Holy shit. And with 4, he was just a little slower. He was wiser to the world. And so it was just more of, his attitude changed, like, here we go again. And that just changes the way that you deliver things. Excited versus I've seen this before. Like I'm done with this shit.
Matt: Right.
Nick: You know? And I gotta save the day. But I think the most important thing that we focused on was not really fine tuning the voice. It was more the attitude in his arc. You said it right. In RE 2, he was a wide eyed boy scout rookie cop seeing everything for the first time. And in 4, he's seen it all before. And so I just wanted to pay respect to that arc and then, of course, the arc within RE 4 is a little bit different as well.
Matt: I gotta say, I really appreciated keeping some of the corny one liners from the original.
Nick: Of course. I mean, the tones, they had to keep the DNA of both games as they remade them.
Matt: For sure.
Nick: They are VERY different games. They could be different IPs, and you wouldn't even know. The only thing that is the same is the character. And, so we tried to really be careful with, like, balancing on that line of, because the first games, the originals were played by different actors, in very different directions but we had to marry this a little bit more because I was playing both.
So as long as people felt the balance but enough of a change, that's a compliment. So thank you.
Matt: Of course. And just out of curiosity, how many times have you completed the original RE 4? You get bonus points if it's on multiple systems.
Nick: Absolutely on multiple systems. Yeah. I have probably beat it realistically, maybe, like, 35 times.
Matt: 35 times?
Nick: That's an educated guess, yeah.
Matt (to Ben): Have you played through all of Resident Evil 4?
Ben: Yes.
Matt: How many times?
Ben: The original or the remake?
Matt: The original.
Ben: I've had it on PlayStation 2. I think it did about 3 times. It was the only game I'd ever done. It was the first game I ever completed multiple times.
Nick: Oh, really? I didn't know that.
Ben: Yeah. It was the first game I, like, I would usually just play games once, and that was it. And that's why I loved RE 4 so much because I just played it so many times. Like, for me, as a kid playing a game twice is actually really light. But it's a really chunky game. And then, obviously, like, I played on PS2, so I had Separate Ways-
Nick: Yeah.
Ben: -already added to it, which I loved. And most people, when they tell me you played on PlayStation 2, that's the worst way of playing it. True. But it's still one of the greatest games of all time.
Matt: In a technical sense, sure. But it's still RE4.
Ben: I've never played anything like it, and I think it cannot be understated the importance of that game.
Nick (to Ben): Are you a Mercenaries guy?
Ben: Yeah. I'm a Mercenaries guy. Like, big time. Like, I, did a lot of mercenaries on RE 4 remake, and I did a lot of mercenaries on RE Village. Fuck me. In order to get the plan on RE village, you have to pay a lot of Mercenaries.
Nick: Oh my god. That was maddening, that mode.
Ben: I completed it. So really I was like, I'm just gonna get that. I'm gonna get the platinum trophy on Resident Evil Village. So I did all the stuff on that and I got, like, maybe 30 hours of that to get that. And then it was like, oh, there's 2 trophies on Mercenaries. Those 2 trophies took ANOTHER 30 FUCKING HOURS to get.
Nick (laughing): I believe it, I believe it.
Ben: And it was like, you had to be so good at that.
Nick: You couldn't mess up. You could not mess up.
Matt: You could not drop a single combo.
Ben: Yeah. It was like you had to keep this combo going, and it was absolutely incredible and infuriating at the same time. And I think when I did it, I was like, my heart was just in that.
Nick: Sometimes they got stuck in the walls and you couldn't shoot them.
Ben: They were a lot more forgiving in the RE4 remake.
Matt: Just one last thing about Mercenaries before I go back is the thing that always got me was enemies that were sniping from top, from always up top, those with arrows, because they're so hard to see because they blend in so well. So that just didn't make it, any better. But, going back to you, Ben-
Ben: Mhmm.
Matt: To talk about Warframe now. Arthur is, well, he's not as angry as Clive is, at least not to the same extent. He doesn't have a living being inside of him the way Clive does. And Warframe also doesn't have the same almost claustrophobic tone that Final Fantasy does. Like, when things are really tense in a cutscene, you feel the tension, like, almost to the point where you feel like if you breathe, someone's gonna get mad at you for making noise.
Ben: Yeah.
Matt: So since Warframe doesn't hold the same tone that Final Fantasy does in the sense that it's not as foreboding, did you find yourself having a bit more fun with Arthur since you were a bit looser as you didn't have to hold onto so much emotional trauma the same way Clive did?
Ben: I think, yeah. It's like I said, it's all about playing what's directly in front of you. And the first thing that we're introduced to with Warframe: 1999 is the team. You know, it's nice. He's not a one man army. He's very much part of a much wider group, and that's the joy of what Warframe is. So I think the most fun people are gonna have and how they're gonna enjoy Arthur is not by himself, it's gonna be in relation to all the other characters. So that's why we get all of them on display at the beginning, and how much they work as a team. It was a real joy. And I think Clive thrives best when he's reacting off other people, when he's reacting off Jill and Joshua. I think, actually, Arthur does a really, really similar thing when he's, you know, combinations with, you know, Aoi or Amir or Quincy. You know, it's very cool to see as you play more of the game, you can see how that kind of affects it as well.
Matt: Absolutely. So now I got 2 more questions, but these are for both of you. I want answers from the both of you. So did nostalgia play a big role in how you conveyed your characters in Warframe: 1999? And if so, what makes the year slash time period so special to you?
Nick: Yeah. It was a very unique time in my life. I was in my mid teens during this time. ‘99. I was about 15 in ‘99. And, I was just, I've never- I'm not the boy band type of guy, but I have a lot of, like, similar energy. And so I would see, like, Backstreet Boys, NSYNC. They were all becoming very popular at that time. And I was very aware of that and, like, how they affected people. All the fans, my friends LOVED them. And so I was just kinda like putting myself in that place and I formed a lot of my musical tastes during that time as well. And so I just kinda kinda transported myself back. It's not that hard because it was a fun time in my life, and I really, I developed slowly into the adult I am now at that time. So it's actually a really cool thing to have a game go back in time.
Matt: Oh yeah, for sure. What about you, Ben?
Ben: I think you can't, you said it yourself, you can't really underestimate the power of nostalgia. It's an incredible drug, and I remember exactly where I was in 1999. I was, I think, 11. And it was huge. I was actually doing my first ever acting job in 1999.
Matt: Really? What was it?
Ben: I was playing Gavroche in the national touring company of Les Miserables, The Little Urchin Boy. And I have this poster that says 1999 to 2000. There was a genuine fear that we wouldn't get to 2000 because of the Y2K mug. It was this kind of silly joke that we had in the cast. And so, yeah, it was kind of my professional debut as an actor at that point, but also just the excitement of what was to come, you know, the ending. There's so much literature around 1999 and what that meant. Was it the end of the world? Was it the beginning of something new?
And I love the way looking back on it now is kind of, like, how crazy that hysteria was. But what we've done in 1999 is looking back and going, what if that hysteria was real? And I knew someone who took all their money out of the bank and put it in gold bars and buried it at the end of their garden because they thought the financial system was gonna crash. Wow. Like, that was, like, one of our kind of, like, crazy friends. My mom's friend took all the money out of her bank because she thought the world was gonna end.
Nick: That's what a lot of people did, yeah.
Ben: Because the banking system was gonna fail. They thought their entire life savings were gonna disappear. And it really can't be underestimated, though, like how actually terrifying that was to some people. Obviously, it was a whimper, but it was a real potential threat to something. And actually, how much we relied on computers. And I think a lot of that's what this is, you know. It's the fear of the fear of, like, relying too much on technology and as a concept and how, you know, the what the Proto-Warframes kind of- Protoframes, sorry, the Protoframes represent is that kind of, like, weird crossing between humanity and, you know, represent is that kind of, like, weird crossing between humanity and essentially, you know, technology. So it's a pretty cool thing to do. But 1999 for me was pop music, a bit of grunge, and the Millennium Dome. In the UK, the Millennium Dome was a huge thing.
Nick: What's that?
Ben: The Millennium Dome is now called the O2 Arena, but it was this, almost monument to the past and, like, and the government spent millions of pounds on this high, huge dome near Canary Wharf. It's still there. It's now called the O2 Arena where most people can kinda do performances, but, like, so much money was plowed into this thing. It's become this iconic landmark in London now. But it was just like it was, it was a bit like a time capsule. It was so crazy. It was like this is history. It's just like if aliens landed and when the world ended, it was almost like come and have a look at this thing.
Nick: How have I never heard of this?
Ben: Because it's now because it doesn't exist anymore. The building exists, but it was iconic and it became part of the, you know, when you think about, like, what London is and you pan over in those movies, it'll always show you the Millennium Dome, what is now the O2 arena. That's wild. Yeah. And the London Eye was there as well. Like, the government spent so much money. There's also this thing, (Ben looks directly at me) sorry to kind of get onto it-
Matt (laughing): It’s fine.
Ben: -in London. Right. There is this Millennium architecture, and there's this very specific type of architecture that exists in London that was specifically designed for the new year. And it's this kind of- and it hasn't aged very well- but it's this kind of chrome metal that looks kind of disgusting, and it's got kind of these unnecessarily smooth edges. And it's all now 25 years old and it looks so ugly. It looks really, really bad.
Nick: Can you take me there next time?
Ben: Yeah I'll take you around and be like here it is you like this ugly bridge? Guess what? Millennium. You like this ugly thing? Millennium.
Matt: So I have one last question for you guys before we could wrap this up. What is the impact you hope to leave with fans that play through Warframe 1999? What is something you want them to remember from this experience, whether that's with your character, throughout just the entirety of the experience, whatever it may be?
Nick: I want them to know that they are cared about. I want them to know that their opinions matter in this world within Warframe and with Digital Extremes, that they're listened to. I think that's the biggest thing.
Matt: Yeah, of course.
Ben: I want them to feel like a badass. I just want them to feel like a badass. I just want them to feel cool that you said, like, it's not for us. It's for the fans to take on now. And if, you know, whatever, if playing through this expansion, if being able to play as these, you know, the skins and the Protoframes, if that makes them feel like cool brained. Like, be cool, however you wanna be cool, whatever makes you feel cool. Like, whatever makes you feel powerful and empowered and seen, I think that's what this game is about, if you don't wanna pick Arthur, you can pick whatever you want because here are all the different paintbrushes to enjoy this video game. So I hope they feel like they have more paints at their disposal to express themselves.
Matt: And there's nothing better than player expression. Thank you guys so very much for doing this and for your time. Again, I'm sorry about the wings, but it was an absolute pleasure to talk to you guys. I love the insight. Thank you so very much for the time.
Ben: We’re just messing with you, bud. We don't need the wings.
So cool you got to talk to these amazing voice actors that are part of other really cool legendary franchises as well! Next time you've gotta bring the wings! :D
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